Lets Race TAG

[Bryan W. Joplin]

We need to start communicating to encourage racing the TAG class. Both Chonda and Shifter classes are developing a good following, one that TAG has had in previous years.

During the next few months, TAG Senior will have some very competitive racing. The fastest drivers to turn laps at Katy will return this summer. Expect to see Garrett Boone, Michael Jones, Will Choice, Adam Miller, Ryan Belanger, Colin Haun, Scott Boone, and others competing in this class. There should be some incredible racing.

TAG Master is seeing a resurgence, but we have members, who practice with their TAG karts, but do not race. The question is, how do we encourage new members to race TAG and get our more senior and sometimes a little more stout drivers to race? What are the issues we could address that would improve TAG Master participation?

For example:
1. Weight class is at the discretion of the Club. We could have a TAG Heavy class, but rather than splitting the drivers, should we move the TAG Master weight up? Would this encourage drivers who did not race because they felt a disadvantage?
2. There are a number of upcoming non race scheduled Saturdays and Sundays. Should we call for an unofficial TAG day and get drivers to the track to practice racing. We could expose everyone to multiple starts, practice passing and run races of a few laps.
3. We could have a tech day. Review kart and engine maintenance. Go over some of the previously published Tech Tips.
4. We could do a complete Leopard engine rebuild.
5. Should we invite non members to talk to us, or come to the track for a demo.

Next to Shifter, TAG is the fastest way to turn laps on the track, and it has a large following in other regions across the country. It is appropriate for new and advanced drivers of all ages. With the introduction of the 2009 Leopard, drivers have the option of buying new, or searching the used market for early model Leopards at substantial savings. The early Leopards have the same power rating as the 2009 model and complete packages have changed hands for as little as $500. This is an incredible value to experience high performance kart racing.

TAG Masters is the best venue for older drivers. We need to encourage participation and make the class as user friendly as possible. Lets get more people to enjoy the experience of competitive racing. The ideas above would help level the playing field, give confidence to new drivers and help reduce cost. I encourage comments for a path forward, or other ideas to encourage participation in the TAG Master Class.

Bryan

[Jean Michel Gaston]

Bryan,

As a new driver in TaG, I would very much appreciate your generous suggestion of having a TaG learning day (or days) both for the driving aspect, but mainly for the maintenance aspect. Having discussed kart racing with many would be racers (as I was for many years as well), the two single most important aspects that deter people from starting are cost and the perceived idea that the maintenance would be over bearing. Preventive maintenance on these karts is simple and not too time consuming, but avoiding it certainly can lead to high expense and time off the track.

JM

[Bryan W. Joplin]

Hi JM,

Thank you for responding to this discussion. With respect to your comment on cost, racing in general is an expensive hobby, but karting can be done on a budget. I had an opportunity to run about 30 laps at Daytona approaching 150 mph and I can tell you 70 mph, 1 inch off the ground, in an open seat is just as exciting. I expect none of us is going to start driving Formula 1 or NASCAR, so if you are going to experience racing, karting is the place to be. And, if you are an adult, TAG Master with a Leopard engine is your best venue at Katy to start and pursue your racing experience. Get your friends involved.

Since you are the only one to respond, I would be happy to help you individually. While many drivers may not do their own mechanicals, I consider working on the kart an important and enjoyable part of racing. I can help you control expense by setting up scheduled maintenance, show you how to repair the most common track damages and rebuild Leopard engines to factory specs. A Leopard top end can be done for under $200 and a bottom end for about $265 ($465 if you need a new connecting rod). This work is within the skill of the home mechanic and does not require expensive tools. The rule of thumb, “if it is metal, it can be repaired”. If you would like some help, you can reach me at 281-356-6438, or b.joplin@sbcglobal.net. I live in the Magnolia area.

Bryan

[Rick Miller]

Great Ideas Brian! Attention to detail, many on track failures are attributed to lack of maintenance. Cleaning your kart thouroughly after each race is paramout. Not only will your investment look great but when you take the time to detail your pride and joy you should have your tools out to check ALL nuts and bolts, ie: motor mount, chain tension, seat bolts, struts, rear bumper, front bumper, wireing harness and all electrical connections, throttle cable fittings, brake bolt and pads, wheels and hubs, clutch...the list goes on. Its a great time to see what needs to be replaced, if you find these small items and repair or replace its to your benefit. Remember, things generally dont break when you are in the back of the pack, its usualy the last lap when you are leading the pack when things give up. Rick

[bomccown]

I am one of those that are new to TaG, but have yet to race. Life has just been very busy. I feel I don't have the seat time in the kart to take a green flag.

I would also be interested in the TaG day at the track and like JM would enjoy the maintenance/rebuild lesson most of all.

Im currently homeless as I sold my home and I'm having another built. Once I'm in the new home I will be on more of a budget.

As far as racing, I feel like I was getting close to that point when the house sold and limited my free time with moving and all.

I plan to be back out there soon, so don't forget about me. Not to concerned about the weight issue even though I'm well over 200#'s. Thanks for the offer of the tech lesson. I will keep checking back here to see if there is enough interest to make it happen.


Bo...

[Matt Johnson]

Hello all, I can tell you that I have 2 other buddies (possibly more if we make the leap) that are SERIOUSLY considering getting into karting but for the reasons mentioned above, mainly cost, we're a bit gun shy.

I have 14 and 8 year old boys that I would also like to get involved, and quite frankly, the idea of 3 carts x $200 a race for tires is enough to make me puke in my mouth a little bit. Not to meniton it seems like I keep reading that you need a new chasis or you're wasting your time. One of my buddies also has a 14 year old that would be involved as well...

My initial plan has been to get some used karts that, while fast, aren't quite up to race specs, and join to just have fun on practice days. I do, however, know myself and I'll want to RACE!

We're also considering motocross bikes as another option, it's a tossup right now, Karts seem to be MUCH more expensive while MX is clearly more injury prone (I raced mx for years, REALLY miss it, but don't miss healing up and I've had wheelchairs flash before my eyes more times than I'd care to recall).

Soooo, I guess what I'm hoping to gain from this is some expert opinions from you experts. I can EASILY buy very clean, used mx bikes (2 smokes, cheap, easy to work on and FUN) for myself and my boys, fully outfit them in gear (I still have all mine) etc... for under $9k but when I start trying to consider going the kart route it seems I would need at LEAST an additional $5-6k to toss at it, and quite frankly, I have a budget to consider. Am I on target or can we realistically get into this and be moderately competitive (not lapped by everyone else!) for that kind of investment?

I suppose I posted in this sub-forum because we're most interested in TAG and happened to see this post in here and if we take the plunge your TAG class might be considerably more filled out....

[Jean Michel Gaston]

Matt,

As a former motorcycle racer, I totally understand your dilemma. Bikes are definitely cheaper, and if your kids have the talent to run up front, then used bikes will be just fine. I think the same can be said here. The learning curve to get to the sharp end of the field is steep, and brand new equipment is not going to make much of a difference until your kids learn the fast way around the track. If your kids are gentle on the equipment, and they have the talent, they can make a good used chassis work as well as a new one.

As for maintenance, these carts are as easy to work on as 2-stroke bikes. Tire wear is higher on the karts for sure, but you can get 5 to 6 hours of track time on a set.

If you all chose to take it up beyond the club level, then the cost goes up with the amount of racing you plan on doing. To be competitive at the higher levels, I think you will agree that in both motocross and karting you will need expensive and fresh equipment.

hope this was helpful. I'm new to karting myself, but I was on the same fence as you for many years before I made the switch.

[Matt Johnson]

Thanks for the input. I probably should have noted that we'd really only be interested in occasional club racing for the most part.

I had originally been thinking I could find some halfway decent used karts and run harder tires on them just to have fun with my boys and friends on the weekends that there are no official events.

Are there others that follow this approach? Is that idea out of the question? Is the track packed with the more serious racers on the non-race weekends?

I know myself well though, and I'll want to go racing at some point......

[Jean Michel Gaston]

You can definitely take the cheaper approach if it's just for fun. Membership cost at Katy is not expensive at all, and you will find that you will always find space at the track on non-race weekends, and it is usually not crowded at all. Only times I've seen more than a handful of karts out there is the saturday right before a race, and still you will only see a few racers out there, fine tuning only, and very friendly.

[Bryan W. Joplin]

Hi Matt (could not resist adding my 2 cents)

First let me say, we are always looking for new members (especially to race against) and no matter what kart you decide to put on the track, you are welcome. Next, put as much value in what I say as what you paid for it. Please be an informed participant and avoid “Buyers Regret”. Come to the track, talk to members with kids your age, talk to our President John Bartos and stop by 3G karting and speak to Abie.

Now with regard to your note. Lets talk safety. When you engage in motorsports you have assumed risk. It is a given. While I have not raced bikes, I suggest you seek out a half dozen members, who have raced bikes extensively and talk to our paramedic, who works both bike and kart events. Their involvement in karting speaks for itself. In the long run, karting may be far less expensive.

With regard to selecting a kart(s) for you and your family, do your research. New or used is a personal thing. I like used to avoid depreciation and the reduced initial investment. Everything on a kart is replaceable, so except for a destroyed frame, your used kart can perform as well as new. I bought a 2yr old Birel Kart that had been raced extensively. The kart is now on year six, and if it loses, it is not the karts fault. I paid $5000, but a kart of this vintage today would obviously be less. In 2009, I bought a 2007 CRG Honda shifter complete for $3800. The kart is very raceable.

I would steer you away from buying someones junk, just to get on the track economically. First, you will not be happy with performance, and if you get the bug like me, you will be buying another kart. Second if you buy junk, you will be stuck with junk, with limited resale value. Good karts have a market. Your research as suggested above will steer you in the right direction.

The class to race will be determine by your kids age and kart/motor selection. For you, it will be kart/motor selection and how fat you are. Kart/motor selection is based on your research above, but here are a few thoughts. There are numerous types of karts and motors raced across the country, but you are considering racing at Katy. Unless you are planning extensive road trips, or think you are a national contender, pick a class, kart and motor that has good participation at Katy. You will have more fun, you will learn more about your kart from others, and the members will enjoy beating you, while you learn to drive. There is always someone trying not to be last.

If you have been watching the forum, there is always the question, should I race shifter or TAG and now the half breed DD2. As kids learn to drive and move through the classes the karts are all momentum karts like TAG. When the drivers become very accomplished, they move into shifter. Do not underestimate their skill. The most successful adult drivers all started in TAG. I encourage you to compare lap times between TAG and shifter. An accomplished TAG driver would run middle of the pack with the shifter drivers. With regard to DD2, I am not a fan. (others are). A couple points; there is not much participation at Katy, and to encourage it splits and dilutes classes; all classes up to shifter are momentum karts with TAG capable of nipping at the heels of shifter; if you are an accomplished driver, why drive a two speed, when six speed is available and enjoyed by the better drivers. If you think you are shifter material, get a real shifter with the less expensive to operate Honda.

A last note on cost. Tires on a TAG kart will give you two competitive race days. The third race day (weekend) you will run the tires, but grip will be fading. Some guys have run the tires competitively four races. At lesser speeds starting out, you may be more likely to get four races. If you race, you always have plenty of used tires for practice, assuming you are not compelled to practice on new tires. Plan on one and a half engine rebuilds each season. Other consumables include chains, sprockets, chain lube, brake pads and bearings. Bring a pad and paper to the track and I will give you a good idea on cost.

We are racing this weekend. I as well as other members would be happy to talk to you. Please be an informed buyer. Talk to those who I have suggested. We would love to have you join the club.
Bryan

[Patrick Roth]

As a newbie to this forum as well as GCKI I'll throw in my two cents:

My biggest issue with racing, as opposed to just doing hot laps, is my fear of accidentally hitting someone. I'm not worried about whether I'm fast or not, or if I break down or not, or even the cost... I'm worried that my lack of experience is going to tick off someone and frankly I'm in this for the fun of it. The last thing I want is someone pissed off after a race because I was in their way or misjudged my braking and bumped into the back of someone.

With that being said my fear is likely irrational and I plan to start racing anyway. See you at the track!

[Bryan W. Joplin]

Hi Patrick,

Your concern is the same as every other racer, when they first started. You must break the ice and get on the track for this concern to go away. Your first 3 races, by rule, will require you to start at the back. This gives you the opportunity to see how a race developes. As the race progresses, it is the responsibility of the driver making a pass to stay clear. So if you are passed, hold your line and if something happens, it will not be your fault. Stuff happens, some people get irritated, just blow it off. In the end, everyone makes nice and we are all friends sharing a common interest. When I first started, I had so many accidents,( not necessarily my fault) the race director asked the other drivers to give me a break, so I could finish a race. It is your turn to be the new person. Look forward to seeing you on the track.

Bryan

[Jean Michel Gaston]

As a newbie to this forum as well as GCKI I'll throw in my two cents:

My biggest issue with racing, as opposed to just doing hot laps, is my fear of accidentally hitting someone. I'm not worried about whether I'm fast or not, or if I break down or not, or even the cost... I'm worried that my lack of experience is going to tick off someone and frankly I'm in this for the fun of it. The last thing I want is someone pissed off after a race because I was in their way or misjudged my braking and bumped into the back of someone.

With that being said my fear is likely irrational and I plan to start racing anyway. See you at the track!

Patrick, I'm looking forward to racing with you. I am fairly new as well, and I am currently the guy bringing in the rear of the field. In the few races I have run with the club, everyone has been very encouraging and helpful, and as far as I know, I have not ruffled any feathers yet. The only way to learn is to go out there and do it. It will not take long for you to get comfortable with your pace and the pace of the others around you (trust me, these guys and gals are fast, so you will only see them at the beginning of the race). Enjoy it, it is a challenging but very rewarding sport.

[Patrick Roth]

Thank you for the comforting responses! If all goes well (and the "boss" approves) I'll be entered in the next race!

Jean Michel, You should know that your spot in the rear is likely to be taken from you (unless you really want it?).

[Jean Michel Gaston]

Thank you for the comforting responses! If all goes well (and the "boss" approves) I'll be entered in the next race!

Jean Michel, You should know that your spot in the rear is likely to be taken from you (unless you really want it?).

Ha ha.... I'll gladly give it up
Hope to see you next week.